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Police Shoot Man dead


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After this incident you'd have a hard time convincing me they are trained, and qualified to carry deadly weapons.

If Im going to have a gun pointed at me ...give me a british copper every time

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In the minds of the officers?  Of course!  What else matters at the time?  That is what they are trained for.

reality matters. Otherwise you could be walking down the street and reach into your pocket for your cell phone and get killed by a cop who (in his mind) thought you were pulling a gun

 

I have said that according to reports it presents the case in a bad light and that more information is needed.  To say that they were automatically wrong is simply incorrect.  Same as saying they were automatically right.

 

never said they were automatically wrong. I have been saying that shoot to kill mentality with no evidence is wrong. they obviously had no evidence of a bombing because there wasnt any

 

Simply put, if they believed the situation was deadly, they were right to shoot.

nope. I dont think they are G-d. If they are wrong then they have been mistrained. and new ways of dealing with this MUST be instituted. Kill if ya think it could be dangerous is VERY wrong. Cops are not trained that way

 

 

  If he was on the ground and they still felt that he was dangerous and could not sufficiently control him, then they were right to shoot.

again. we know he had no bomb.. what were they thinking he was dangerous about. there were a few cops and one of him. they were NOT right to shoot (IMO)

 

If they did not believe there was a danger, then it was an execution, they had no valid reason to shoot.

 

I think they panicked because of the bombings. forgot any training they had.

 

Whether or not any of that is true remains to be seen, yet people are passing judgement on it. 

 

the only judgement I am making is that I believe this person would be alive today if the bombings never happened and if you believe that, then this man was wrongly killed

 

The fact is that the validity of the decision to shoot is purely based on what is in the officers mind and whether or not that was reasonable for him/her to be thinking. 

I certainly hope not. I hope its what he was trained to look for. trained to see and trained to do. not purely based on whats in his mind. Then we are bound to see many more innocent people killed.

 

 

Just to say that they had him on the ground does not necessarily mean that they could not have reason to shoot. 

Tell me a reason to shoot since he had no bomb. And let say he had no weapon in his hand

 

he was not part of the bombing that was supposedly proven. If that is true, he shooting was not justified.

 

 

This is all my opinion. I appreciate telling me what you think. I dont think I can see it your way

 

I will totally agree to disagree here

 

:beer:

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Most of them simply aren't trained for it.  They can't be armed overnight as it would take a great effort to get them all qualified to carry.

 

 

Those that do carry are qualified though.

If they are simply not trained for it, for G-d sakes take the guns out of their hands please.

 

IMO - you just proved to me that they made a mistake and the reason is that they are not properly trained for it. I think they all were carrying weapons whether they were trained or not after the bombing

Edited by hftmrock
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No wonder most London police are not allowed to carry guns. These idiots are obviously not competent enough to carry straws and spit balls, never mind weapons that shoot "real" bullets.

How do you know this Bruce? Have you ever been an English policeman? Do you know the police officers involved? Do you have experience of any English or Welsh police force?

 

I would imagine all the answers to be 'No' so I find your post inaccurate as well as offensive. Blanket condemnation.

 

Jack

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If they are simply not trained for it, for G-d sakes take the guns out of their hands please.

 

IMO - you just proved to me that they made a mistake and the reason is that they are not properly trained for it. I think they all were carrying weapons whether they were trained or not after the bombing

They were trained allegedly by the SAS.
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see if the identity of the "police officers " are released or not ....? ...if not ...maybe not police ...?

 

Might be military ..! ... same situation ..different training...... for a different outcome ...

 

either way ....the Brazilian was another victim of what has happenend... blame the terrorists

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blame the terrorists

I have, on both sides. ;)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Still have no opinion if it was justified or not because of a lack of information. I still don't know if the man was connected to a terror cell or what, just know that he's been bored 5 times and he apparently was not listening to instructions.

Edited by Intratech
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see if the identity of the "police officers " are released or not ....? ...if not ...maybe not police ...?

 

Might be military ..! ... same situation ..different training...... for a different outcome ...

 

either way ....the Brazilian was another victim of what has happenend... blame the terrorists

The terrorists didn't shoot him 5 times. That was an idiot wearing a uniform who somehow mistakenly, or otherwise was allowed to cary a deadly weapon. ;)
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Under normal circumstances our police would not have reacted like that ... It's a direct result of the bombings

that is my exact reason for saying its wrong.

 

the only reason the guy got killed was because of cops overreacting to a situation that they would have acted differently if the bombings hadnt happened.

 

the man who got killed lost his rights (as well as his life) due to this

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that is my exact reason for saying its wrong.

 

the only reason the guy got killed was because of cops overreacting to a situation that they would have acted differently if the bombings hadnt happened.

 

the man who got killed lost his rights (as well as his life) due to this

Exactly!

 

All hail the king of reason! :worship:

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no it doesnt

 

anymore than gitmo is a response to yours .....

 

just sad all around

I'm not happy about this gitmo situation either. Trust and believe if I was in charge things would be a LOT different in this country.
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The terrorists didn't shoot him 5 times. That was an idiot wearing a uniform who somehow mistakenly, or otherwise was allowed to cary a deadly weapon

I would really like to know what you think should have been done Bruce? You blow off so much hot air, you last two quotes I would expect to hear from someone in a school playground.

 

From what you have said and the way you have said it, you don't have a very good insight into British policing.

 

Jack

Edited by Char
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IF the man was already restrained and posed no threat to others then shooting him was wrong and criminal and im not sure what the possible motive might be there.

 

BUT if he refused to halt and comply then i dont think i can fault the officers.

 

ya'll will have to excuse me. 9/11 is still very vivid in my mind. i remember everything about how i felt that day. the horrible realization that it wasnt debris but people jumping and the sickness i felt from thinking why dont they shoot the planes out of the sky, where is the military? and how i felt watching the london attacks, and madrid and the uss cole and all the other terrorist attacks. and i remember vividly going to bed that night :filtered: off galore that we were not leveling the middle east. its just how i am.

 

i love my country. it is second only to my family and God. im so incredibly proud to be an american and equally proud to be a republican and i stand firm in my beliefs. i dont care if its muslims or arabs or chineese or other americans that bring on the terror, that matters not to me, they are all equally deserving of the worst possible end to thier lives. be it at the hands of the cops, or the military or being executed in a prison or tortured down at gitmo. i simply dont care. it doesnt matter to me if we americans bring justice to terrorists or if the british do, or the australians of the cubans for that matter. as long as it happens. i dont care how they do it either. if that makes me wrong or bad or inhumane, whatever, its how i feel.

 

i dont expect anyone here on this forum to agree or think ive got it all figured out, i dont, and i can only express my views and try to understand the views of others. ive learned a lot about the other side of the argument from people here and it appears that the man the london police shot was an innocent man and that is a criminal act and while i dont pretend to know what the officer thought i think he acted without thinking and its a tragedy.

 

but as far as terrorists go, i say we get them by any means possible, whatever that entails.

 

thanks for listening.

Edited by Angela
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No wonder most London police are not allowed to carry guns. These idiots are obviously not competent enough to carry straws and spit balls, never mind weapons that shoot "real" bullets.

Thats pathetic drivel, Bruce and you know it.
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Nobody lost rights, rights did not change.

 

 

Step outside when it is sunny and nice and you will likely enjoy yourself, step outside during a class 5 hurricane and you will have a difficult time to say the least.

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Thats pathetic drivel, Bruce and you know it.

that it is, and in addition to that its insulting and rude and antagonistic. officers make mistakes and this one is a biggie, cost someone their life, but it hardly reflects on the entire london police force and thier ability to fire a weapon or fight crime.

 

chop, who are you talking to?

Edited by Angela
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There was a post above that said that rights had changed. I was responding to that.

 

 

As far as there having been a "mistake" we don't know that yet. Even if he was of no relationship to the bombings (and they are saying he was not) it does not mean the police made a mistake. They may have, or maybe not.

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I don't know how the hell some of you expect the police to act in situations like this. Chopdoc is right, the police may not have made a mistake.

We simply don't have enough information on any of this yet.

Most of the posts here are pure speculation, so how about a little more tolerance for one of the best and fairest police forces in the world?

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Nobody lost rights, rights did not change.

 

 

Step outside when it is sunny and nice and you will likely enjoy yourself, step outside during a class 5 hurricane and you will have a difficult time to say the least.

nobody lost rights????

 

tell that to the dead man that at the moment resisted arrest. Show me the law that says resisting arrest with no weapon will get you killed.

 

 

you are innocent until proven guilty in this country and he was executed because of police overreacting. (IMHO)

 

he lost all his rights

Edited by hftmrock
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