Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Keith W

New Osama Bin Laden Tape

Recommended Posts

Without the Bin Ladens of this world, Bush has nothing. Without the Bush's of this world, the Bin Ladens of the world have nothing.

 

No Bin Ladens, no (war on terror) = no Bush

 

No Bush, (nothing to rally against) = no Bin Laden

 

The Bin Ladens/terrorists need people like Bush, he is the poster boy for everything they hate. That in it's self gets people like Bin Laden more support from would be (undecided) followers.

 

The Bush's of the world need people like Bin Laden he is the poster boy for everything they hate. That in it's self gets people like Bush more support from would be (undecided) voters.

 

Without his war on terror diverted to Iraq, Bush can't "take a stand" against anything, except the little peple of this country(very unpopular thing to do) thus his presidency/election would fall apart. I think it already has, but that is just one mans opinion. We will know for sure Tuesday.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"If I were Bin, and I wanted Bush elected, I'd make a video stating what a silly muslim I'd been and how I wanted to be a Bushist christian instead. " Well I am not sure that would be particularly effective.

 

First I think the only stronger pro-Bush statement he could make would be to surrender to Bush. Failing that he could provide (probably false) intelligence of his whereabouts so Bush could deploy special forces to some area that is hard to access and slow to get him out of. This would allow Bush to appear to be on the verge of capturing or killing Bin Laden. Watch the news for the next 80 hours.

 

Second Bush's Christian principles are finite. When a female murderer in Texas converted to Christianity and and worked (within the prison) a Christian mission, when many Christian Church's requested that her sentence be commuted to life he declined to commute her sentence. Many of Bush's followers are similarly finite. They would want and and many less zealous Christians would want Bin Laden dead (ideally by slow torture). I am not sure Bin would want to make that sacrifice. Also Bin's main goal remains to harm the American interest and strengthen his movement. A conversion to Christianity would not help his ultimate goal. It would be counter productive.

 

I think that in general people rally for their government or their leader when others pick on the government or leadership. People will readily say "It is one thing for me say bad stuff about that idiot, he is my idiot, but they (foreigners) have no right to bad mouth him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe the fact is that reading so much into the intent of Osama lends him more credibility than he deserves and is in fact a sign of a victory for terrorism.

 

 

I for one am not so inclined to discuss what this man has to say about anybody or anything.

 

Frankly it surprises me that so many do discuss it.

 

 

The more you talk about what he says, the more he wins.

 

I am one to consider the words of almost anybody. If I feel the need to oppose what is said I generally do it strongly as that is my nature. In the case of someone such as Osama, the words carry zero weight and do not merit my recognition.

 

If he makes a specific threat I may listen so I take proper action, other than that I cannot give him the floor as you folks can.

 

 

My advice to you is stop listening to him. By doing so you are further victimizing yourself and are falling into his traps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My advice to you is stop listening to him. By doing so you are further victimizing yourself and are falling into his traps.

Same advice I give about GW Bush. :tup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Same advice I give about GW Bush.

I heard his speech in September already.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You know, I remember this TV series , in the '80's I think, 'Whoops, Apocalypse' . The similarity with current events is stunning. They should rerun it . Before Tuesday. :lol:

 

Edit; Found it.

 

 

 

Found it.

Also queering the picture is the mad master-of-disguise Lacrobat - the world's most hunted international terrorist and nuclear-bomb-stealer - and, perhaps most frighteningly of all, the Deacon, the fanatical, God-fearing American security adviser, a man who believes he has a direct hotline to the deity.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/articles...e_7776790.shtml

 

The casting of Whoops Apocalypse was exceptional: the players included John Cleese(as Lacrobat) appearing in his only sitcom outside of his own Fawlty Towers John Barron and Geoffrey Palmer from The Fall And Rise Of Reginald Perrin Richard Griffiths, Peter Jones, David Kelly, Ed Bishop, Bruce Montague, Richard Davies, Barry Morse and, from the vanguard of the new so-called 'alternative comedy' movement, Rik Mayall (who appeared in one episode) and Alexei Sayle. It might just be stretching belief to suggest that every one of these and the remainder of the huge cast understood all that was going on in their scripts, for certainly much of the show left viewers baffled, but, then again, since the world has always been governed by decisions of uncomprehending madness then the sitcom was merely an exaggerated but otherwise accurate reflection of the fact.

:lol: Edited by moon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:lol: Chop, you sure make some funny commentaries at times :lol:

 

I thank you for them all ;) :beer:

Well, the topic seems to be that what he has to say is actually manipulating matters, hence if what he says is given no attention the effct he has in this regard will be nullified. Drawing attention to what he has to say would seem to amplify what he says. Our goal should be not allow him to further affect our societies and our lives as that would simply be satisfying his goals.

 

 

So....it does not seem so funny to me. But if you get a laugh out of it then I suppose some good has been served.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"I believe the fact is that reading so much into the intent of Osama lends him more credibility than he deserves and is in fact a sign of a victory for terrorism."

 

To ignore him does not make him less credible. This is not a simple verbal reinforcement paradigm where mentioning his name emboldens him. He is already credible.

 

This is someone that killed more American's on 1 day than anyone since WW2. This is someone that the Republican apologists credit with having almost single handedly destroying the robust American economy. An economy that has not recovered (by any measure) to pre-attack levels. This is somebody that has evaded the America armies for 3 years and evaded American attacks for several years before that. This is somebody that is thought of as a hero by large segments of the world's Muslim population. This is somebody that is daily recruiting people to his cause. This is somebody who threatens the US and other western democracies everyday he is alive. How can his words not have meaning?

 

What is the alternative? To ignore his statements? To pretend we are unaffected by his acts? To say that he does not influence our security acts? To say that we take off our shoes to board planes because the airport security really want to see what kind of socks we wear?

 

I recognize that this is the strategy for the economy, for stem cell research, for Iraq, for nuclear proliferation but surely we cannot continue that pretense with Osam as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If someone hates me enough to want to kill me, I sure would want to know why.

You guys were on the receiving end of his murderous actions and I can kinda understand your blind hatred of him. I however am on the outside to a greater degree and thus have the ability to see things without the smog of passion and can appreciate the fact that the coin has 2 sides.

 

 

Information is power.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For the alternative reasoning read my previous post, the one you didn't quote.

 

 

Ignore him?

 

No

 

 

Does he have credibility? Not in the sense that you are assigning it.

 

If you admit that his strategy and intention is to manipulate through his statements, then the answer is obvious.

 

 

The discussion has been regarding just such an intent on his part, hence the answer is obvious to me. Remove that effect.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, the topic seems to be that what he has to say is actually manipulating matters, hence if what he says is given no attention the effct he has in this regard will be nullified

..but I believe matters are in desperate need of manipulation and that many of the grievances are just, so I'll continue to listen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If someone hates me enough to want to kill me, I sure would want to know why.

 

But by the admission of the people in the discussion, his words are manipulation, so how can you get and anwer to your question from them?

 

 

Manipulation is not information.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

..but I believe matters are in desperate need of manipulation and that many of the grievances are just, so I'll continue to listen.

Some of his grievances may be just. But the time for listening is over.

 

He could have used his money to achieve a political office or something like that. As it is he chose violent methods. For me that negates his voice. He chose the type of fight he wants.

 

 

 

Terrorism cannot be allowed to be a tool to give people a voice as that is the ultimate goal of such acts and would signal victory for the perpetrators.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His words are just that - WORDS! I don't feel manipulated. Do you get all manipulated if you accidentily watch one of those nasty media reports on TV you so despise?

 

OBL made a very good point in mentioning Swedens not being a target of his yet they are Westerners. That small point alone shoots down those idiots that eternally claim that the Fundamentalists hate the West and want to destroy us all just because we are infidels........unless OBL isn't deemed a fundamentalist :huh:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

His words are just that - WORDS!  I don't feel manipulated. Do you get all manipulated if you accidentily watch one of those nasty media reports on TV you so despise? 

 

OBL made a very good point in mentioning Swedens not being a target of his yet they are Westerners. That small point alone shoots down those idiots that eternally claim that the Fundamentalists hate the West and want to destroy us all just because we are infidels........unless OBL isn't deemed a fundamentalist  :huh:

The previous posts indicate that he is manipulating the election succfessfully by his words, that is what I am talking about T.

 

Go back and look.

 

 

And by the way, I am not one to support the people who say he wants to eliminate all infidels. You can search my posts but I assure you I don't say that.

Edited by Chopdoc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Some of his grievances may be just.  But the time for listening is over.

 

He could have used his money to achieve a political office or something like that.  As it is he chose violent methods.  For me that negates his voice.  He chose the type of fight he wants.

 

 

 

Terrorism cannot be allowed to be a tool to give people a voice as that is the ultimate goal of such acts and would signal victory for the perpetrators.

The Middle East has plenty of people in political office already....it didn't stop us stomping all over their land, rights and national/religious values. So I would argue that they have no option but to take up arms against us. As for the time for listening being over; when did we ever start?

 

 

Terrorism cannot be allowed to be a tool to give people a voice as that is the ultimate goal of such acts and would signal victory for the perpetrators.

America circa 1770's makes a mockery of this point.

 

And by the way, I am not one to support the people who say he wants to eliminate all infidels. You can search my posts but I assure you I don't say that.

 

I know that, but this isn't a debate between just you and I :lol: Edited by Sir T Fireball

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Middle East has plenty of people in political office already....it didn't stop us stomping all over their land, rights and national/religious values. So I would argue that they have no option but to take up arms against us.  As for the time for listening being over; when did we ever start?

 

 

 

America circa 1770's makes a mockery of this point.

Actually, we still had to fight a rwar, so no, it does not mock the point.

 

 

Our acts did not give us a voice in the 1770s, gunpowder and blood did but only after victory.

 

 

 

I never said that we didn't perpetuate it, as I said some of his grievances have merit.

 

 

The point is it has escalated beyond the point of listening to that particular man.

 

If he can win, if he can destroy the United States of America then let the history books give his words credence. Until then his words should carry no weight.

Edited by Chopdoc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I know that, but this isn't a debate between just you and I  :lol:

I just wanted it to be clear, and not just for you. :)

 

 

It is possible to support the war, the United States, and oppose Osama without being a radical, or a war monger, or ignorant. In fact I would say that is the case for most who support these causes.

Edited by Chopdoc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...but he doesn't want to destroy the USA. From his own lips and not the twisted spun version we usually get from our own people...

 

Your security is not in the hands of Kerry or Bush or al Qaeda. Your security is in your own hands. Any nation that does not attack us will not be attacked.

Backed up by his other statement regarding Sweden (which could have been Switzerland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland etc...).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is possible to support the war, the United States, and oppose Osama without being a radical, or a war monger, or ignorant. In fact I would say that is the case for most who support these causes.

 

If you refer to the war in Iraq, I disagree totally. I believe one has to be a war mongering, ignorant radical (or someone high up in the arms or oil industry) to support the illegal invasion and subsequent murder of many thousands of civillians by our troops. If however, you refer to a war on terrorism, I agree totally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

...but he doesn't want to destroy the USA. From his own lips and not the twisted spun version we usually get from our own people...

 

 

 

Backed up by his other statement regarding Sweden (which could have been Switzerland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland etc...).

There you go listening to him again.

 

It does not need to be twisted by the media, it has been twisted by his mind already.

 

He is not a sovereign nation, nor is he trying to be.

 

 

Just exactly who does he want us to not attack?

 

 

Who did we attack to provoke 9/11?

 

The United States of Bin Laden?

 

 

 

There have been many transgressions of sovereignties in the Middle East by the US, those sovereign nations need to deal with it, not this terrorist.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you refer to the war in Iraq, I disagree totally. I believe one has to be a war mongering, ignorant radical (or someone high up in the arms or oil industry) to support the illegal invasion and subsequent murder of many thousands of civillians by our troops. If however, you refer to a war on terrorism, I agree totally.

I refer to both, and I am no war monger, nor a radical.

 

Do you really believe that there are so many war mongers and radicals?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...