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Countrydave55

Patterns Of Behavior

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We all know that before 9-11 Bush felt that Al Quida was not a big threat. We know he was focused on Iraq. We know that the administration was not on a "war footing". We all know that Bush has made no mistakes in his administration (or ever depending upon which interview you rely upon).

 

Yesterday the Bush administration said that they were aware of the vaccine problem since 2001. They said the problem was not theirs because the problem has been recognized since 1991. They also said that there is nothing that they can do about the problem because this is a legal liability problem that is keeping the manufacturers from manufacturing in the US.

 

First according to www.factcheck.org this problem has nothing to do with legal liability. The companies making the vaccines were US companies with overseas manufacturing plants. A US tortfeasor in the US would be liable whether they made the vaccine in Washington DC or in Bangladesh. So this is simply a red herring.

 

Second the administration knew about a vaccine problem in 2001 and was told in 2003 that there may be a specific problem with 1 of the 2 suppliers. There was a vaccine shortage in 2003 as well (remember last years vaccine shortage), although not this severe.

 

My point is the administration seems to get all kinds of warnings that it simply discounts until it is too late. Then they say "it was the other guys fault". Then they say "Well there isn't anything we could have done about it anyway". Isn't this the pattern? Haven't we seen this with terrorists, the flu vaccine, the economy, Iraqi intelligence estimates?

 

Is it true that nothing can/could be done? No.

 

Before 9-11 aggressive pursuit of the terrorists and "swatting at flies" may have disrupted the terrorist plot or at least diminished the scope.

 

The vaccine supply could have been addressed in a number of ways. The FDA could inspect the vaccine manufacturer when the company was suspect. (This is a common practice and is a prerequisite before medications can be imported). This would have given us months of warning to look for other suppliers or to make that company improve its quality control. The Government could have guaranteed purchase of 20 million units or 50 million units the same way the government guarantees farm prices. The CDC could control the distribution of the vaccine instead of giving it to the healthy Congress and letting the vaccine go to the highest bidder on the market. There are reports that the $20 a unit vaccine is selling for $800 when it can be found.

 

It seems to me this administration has a pattern of making very poor judgment, blaming the product of that judgment on previous administrations, accepting no responsibility, and then claiming that nothing they could have done would make any difference anyway. Is this a way to run a household? Is this a way to run a business? Is this a way to run a country?

 

Does anyone else see this pattern?

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Certainly do - and the current administration in the US isn't alone in some of the tactics you mention. In the UK the Conservative party (the then more right wing party of the mainstream - the one headed by Thatcher) often blamed the previous governments faults for their inheriting of a problem - they continued to use this particular tactic right up until 1997 when they lost the election. By then the argument was getting a bit old as the previous government had been ousted some 18 years earlier - but still they tried it. My guess is if Bush wins in November then in 2008 his people will be using the same tactic about inherited problems...good luck with swallowing that one...

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If the previous administrations were to blame, administrations voted in by the People, then it's all the People's fault. Isn't that the message of the current administration ?

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The administration is now on the talk shows saying that it can't get its judges appointed and legislation implemented because of the obstructionist Democrats in the legislature. They seem to forget that they are the majority party in both houses of congress and that except for some judicial appointments they can do whatever they like legislatively.

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Actually, since every administration blames the previous it goes back to the Continental Congress.

 

 

This is politics boys and girls, they have been doing it this way a long time and you just notice now?

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Well, I'm still waiting for any President to at least make a good excuse for why they dropped the ball on anything... Instead we get this sort of thing.

 

I ran out of gas, I had a flat tire, I didn't have enough money for cab fare, my tux didn't come back from the cleaners, an old friend came in from out of town, someone stole my car, there was an earthquake, a terrible flood, locusts! It wasn't my fault, I swear to God!

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Well, I'm still waiting for any President to at least make a good excuse for why they dropped the ball on anything... Instead we get this sort of thing.

 

I ran out of gas, I had a flat tire, I didn't have enough money for cab fare, my tux didn't come back from the cleaners, an old friend came in from out of town, someone stole my car, there was an earthquake, a terrible flood, locusts! It wasn't my fault, I swear to God!

You forgot "My dog ate it!".

 

:P

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Actually, since every administration blames the previous it goes back to the Continental Congress.

 

 

This is politics boys and girls, they have been doing it this way a long time and you just notice now?

Harry Truman said, "The buck stops here."

 

Not all politicians are weasels. Citizens need to reject those who are not accountable. Bush will never be accountable--by his own admission, he has never made a mistake.

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-by his own admission, he has never made a mistake.

I don't recall him saying that he hadn't made any. I recall him saying that he couldn't think of any, which is way, way worse. :rolleyes:

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Harry Truman said, "The buck stops here."

 

Not all politicians are weasels. Citizens need to reject those who are not accountable. Bush will never be accountable--by his own admission, he has never made a mistake.

That's true, but can you name some current major one's that are not weasels? One?

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In fact, he said, even some of the poorest Venezuelans oppose Chavez, who has bitterly divided the country into those who support his reform programs and those who believe he is taking Venezuela toward Cuba-style communism.

 

 

Ah...a divider.....

 

 

Chavez was ousted in a coup in April 2002 but returned to power two days later.

 

The firebrand populist survived a two-month oil strike aimed at forcing him from office and in August beat back a recall campaign by winning a national referendum with 59 percent of the vote.

 

Opposition leaders insist he won the recall election through fraud, even though former U.S. President Carter and the Organization of American States back the results.

 

 

 

 

Hmm....no kidding....the US backs hte results.....interesting.....

 

 

 

I'm not sure I understand the point of posting this article in this thread but I liked it. I was in fact in Venezuela in the late 90s and witnessed some of this in person. The funny thing is that people often thought I was related to him....we share a last name.

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Now, we find out that the Bush game plan didn't call for securing the explosives stored in weapons dumps. Securing oil fields was a higher priority than securing 380 tons of the most powerful non-nuclear explosives on the planet. Tons have been looted and will be used against Americans--boy, I feel safer already.

 

But, it's not the administration's fault. Nor is it Bush's fault. He's perfect--just listen to him.

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I din't know politicians made battle plans.

 

Blame the generals....and they are not part of the Bush administration.

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Now, we find out that the Bush game plan didn't call for securing the explosives stored in weapons dumps. Securing oil fields was a higher priority than securing 380 tons of the most powerful non-nuclear explosives on the planet. Tons have been looted and will be used against Americans--boy, I feel safer already.

 

But, it's not the administration's fault. Nor is it Bush's fault. He's perfect--just listen to him.

Sounds like they have been gone for quite some time.

 

http://www.drudgereport.com/nbcw.htm

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Sounds like they have been gone for quite some time.

 

http://www.drudgereport.com/nbcw.htm

NBCNEWS reported: The 380 tons of powerful conventional explosives were already missing back in April 10, 2003 -- when U.S. troops arrived at the installation south of Baghdad!

 

 

Interesting.

 

 

Sooo, how do we lay this on Bush again?

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We blame Bush in the top news stories of the day and the front pages of all the newspapers.

 

Then we come back tonight and on page 46 in print so small that you need a magnifying glass to read it we tell everyone that they were gone long before the military ever got there.

 

Very effective campaigning for John Spinmeister. :lol:

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The administration is now on the talk shows saying that it can't get its judges appointed and legislation implemented because of the obstructionist Democrats in the legislature. They seem to forget that they are the majority party in both houses of congress and that except for some judicial appointments they can do whatever they like legislatively.

 

When did the Law change???

 

I thought it takes a 2/3 majority to appoint a judge to the supreme court so how can they do what they want with only a very slight majority.

 

If the Law changed, let me know so I can update my knowlege base. ;)

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From the AP newswire:

 

At the Pentagon, an official who monitors developments in Iraq said US-led coalition troops had searched Al-Qaqaa in the immediate aftermath of the March 2003 invasion and confirmed that the explosives, which had been under IAEA seal since 1991, were intact. Thereafter the site was not secured by U.S. forces, the official said, also speaking on condition of anonymity.

 

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pag...d=1098677410357

 

 

 

 

Let's just assume he's lying and move on to another point. From White House spokesman Scott McClellan:

 

 

MR. McCLELLAN: That's why I said, we were informed on October 15th. Condi Rice was informed days after that. This is all in the last, what, 10 days now.

 

 

Q Go through the tick-tock one more time. Allawi tells the IAEA about it October 10th and then --

MR. McCLELLAN: Well, the Iraqi government told the International Atomic Energy Agency on October 10th that these munitions or these high explosives were missing, because of looting that occurred sometime after April 9th, 2003. And these were subject to -- some of these were subject to agency monitoring, and that's why they informed the IAEA.

Q But, Scott --

Q Who told the White House? I mean, did somebody tell the U.S. embassy in Baghdad and they told the White House?

MR. McCLELLAN: No, no, no. The IAEA informed the U.S. mission in Vienna first. And then -- and then, as I said, Condi was informed days after that and she informed the President.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/20...20041025-1.html

 

 

Well, it was nice of the UN to tell the Bush Administration about it, otherwise they never may have known. 380 tons of a powerful explosive used to detonate nuclear bombs just disappears and these guys at the White House don't know? Bush claims to be in control, yet the Pentagon says it's known about it for 18 months, and the White House doesn't know—and only knows now thanks to the UN. Fantastic. Are we supposed to believe this?

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there have been other reports that the munition was there and destroyed, was there and stolen, or was moved. Either way someone should figure it out because its a very sad situation in any event.

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and the White House doesn't know—and only knows now thanks to the UN. Fantastic. Are we supposed to believe this?

 

This is just another attempt to manipulate the election next week.

 

If the US knew about these, they would have been destroyed on the spot.

 

Anyone that believes that GWB knew about these and did not even secure them needs some serious help.

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Are we supposed to believe this?

Supposed to? I don't know. Should we? I don't think so, no.

 

I think the real truth may not even have been touched on yet. Speculating about what GWB knew and when and what he did or didn't do about it is still just speculation, regardless of news reports, confidential sources, etc.

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